Jen-Hsun on Nvidia's bad chips
Nvision '08 Blame the potato famine
THE INQ CAUGHT up with Nvidia CEO Jen Hsun Huang at his post key note Q&A earlier and asked him why the company wasn't disclosing information about their bad chips.
"How could you guys possibly even say that?" he replied, looking peeved. "The first person in the world who talked about the chip issue was me," he said, adding "I issued a press release with a 200 million dollar reserve and, in fact, our customers were saying 'Jen Hsun, why did you do that? "
Well, why did he do that? According to Huang, "The logic is impeccable. We know that there are some failures that are associated with our chips, we know that it's related to specific combination of the chip and the design of the notebook."
Battling to defend himself, Huang continued, "Most of the notebooks are fine. my notebook is fine." Well good for you. Aren't you lucky, eh?
But Huang was adamant that everything that could be done was being done to solve the problem.
"I go to the OEM and tell the OEM, 'lets fix that, no questions asked. lets just go solve it. In fact, I'll put a reserve in place, so that if you were to solve it, I'll pay you back," he claimed.
"Now, I just sold a chip for $20 and I might have to spend $200 to help repair a notebook. Just think about that for a second. Nobody has ever done that before," Huang reckoned, adding with nauseating noble flourish, "I just don't want the consumers to have to fight the process." Awww, what a sweetheart.
It seems, however, that people can be cruel and unwilling to trust the selfless goodness of Nvidia.
Huang said, "It's a little bit messy because the competition wants to stir it up and there are people who want to stir it up, but its not really that complicated in the end."
Huang also admitted, "We're seeing a higher than what we would like to see failure rate, but if the consumer has a failure to report, I can get it fixed right away."
Asked if he would like to point a finger at anyone in particular, Huang rephrased the query stating, "I guess the question is, Who's to blame?" By way of answer Huang noted, "We use an industry standard process, how we manufacture the chip is identical to a lot of companies and this particular bump underfill material has been used to manufacture billions and billions of chips, not billions of chips."
He added, "It's just there's a happy circumstance or unhappy circumstance that just happens to be exactly right on power, thermal...and just happened to hit that spot." But, said the Nvidia chief, "Ultimately the way I look at it is there's nobody to blame."
"But who's responsible?" he went on, "I'm going to stand up and be partly responsible, and the OEMs obviously we're working with, they feel that because its their notebooks they're partly responsible. If anybody else volunteers to be responsible, I'm happy to let them be part of that. But I don't need to wait for anybody else."
Huang also revealed that it was consumers who first discovered the problem, and that it was very difficult to recreate the failure in a lab. " It took a long long time to make it fail," he said, adding that the defect was not detectable at shipping.µ

Comments
wtf
Is this real or tongue in cheek? I can't tell.It seems like sour grapes with a few Jen-Hsun quotes sprinkled on top. Typical Inq. Though I'm sure it was hard to write through the haze of bitter tears. What happened, did nVidia rape you when you were a child?
bitter tears
Khan, does Nvidia give you a lifetime supply of lollipops?Well, I've got some bitter tears, from buying nvidia after I swore I'd never do it again. I've got Nv chips in my laptop (an 8600M GT) and an 8800GT in my desktop, and because of the Inq I can be sure one of them is probably going to fail (it's already played-up intermittently).
I'd rather the Inq made a big story of this, rather than sweeping it under the carpet, where fanboys like you would rather have it!
Were You Even At the Show
that's odd... this entire story looks like it was lifted from here:http://venturebeat.com/2008/08/26/qa-with-nvidia-ceo-jen-hsun-huang-on-visual-computing-tension-with-intel-and-product-bugs/
Just about word for word. Maybe you added some of your own stuff in to make it appear original?
Regardless, shoddy piece of work.
Flaky nVidiot chips? Never!
I have a Dell Latitude D820 with an nVidia Quadro 120 NVS (not even the one "affected" however, there is enough heat in this baby to give me problems and the occasional hard lock... I even get visible corruption of pixels on the screen. How's that for nVidia quality? Now, this has happened to me on 2 machines (corporate laptops) and i haven't even been pushing them hard in a game (it's a corporate laptop) and this has happened. I say, I am glad this doesn't have a beefier GPU in it, as this thing runs plenty hot (not hot enough to scald like the P4 toaster laptops of yester year) and i really don't need to play games.Long point succinct: I had guessed my vid card was causing instability in my lappy ever before this saga broke; this only serves to confirm my suspicions and that nVidia cut some corners in their manufacturing process and stretched the tolerances of their products too far in order to take the mythical performance crown, instead of focusing on a quality product that gets respectable performance within a more acceptable heat envelope, using less power... after all, people who use GPUs in their laptops might actually want to use them for more than 30 mins on a single battery.
F**K NVIDIA!
A while ago I reported that Nidia had removed the 'Ato detect fullscreen' otherwise known as 'Video Mirror' from their drivers for 8*** series and above cards.Well I recently tested their 175 drivers which although the option was still there in the control panel DID NOT WORK! It was 'broken'.
I had a sneaky feeling this was their first move in removing it altogether for their entire video card range.
I WAS RIGHT!
I tested the 179 beta drivers and THE OPTION IS NOW ENTIRELY GONE!
I use a 7600GT card and the option is there and working in their 169 drivers.
Nvidia admitted openly that they removed the option 'ntentionally' and it is 'by design' due to DRM.
ATI on the other hand have not done any such thing and sending fullscreen video to the S-Video output whlst having it windowed or minimized on the desktop still worlks. This is A MUST for video editors and people who use projection systems (DJ types etc). Try scaling a Winamp video effect to fullscreen without the CPU chugging even on the fastest of quad core system.
Why is TheINQ not reporting on this? I have posted it plenty of times but it never gets mentioned on the front page.
HOW MUCH ARE NVIDIA PAYING YOU TO STAY QUIET NICK???
Jen is cool
I'm an ATI supporter too, but I thought Jen was cool for taking the fall. How many GMs of CEOs are willing to stand up an say "It was my fault" and not blame the engineers, testers, and manufactorers.Who's to blame? Nvidia...
Well regardless of using an industry standard process or not, they are using a much larger die than anyone in the industry, thus it's Nvidia's job to validate the large die works properly with the ubm underfill material. There are standard qualification procedures that OEM companies must use to validate the packaging and system. Simply stating that "others use this material" is hogwash, as they are using it on a 30mm2 die, not a 500mm2 die. What a bunch of engineering dimwits.lollipops
Ross:No, but I wish they did. I'm just commenting on the nature of this article. It is simply unreadable because it's so full of crap.
I'm not happy with nVidia either, and I have no problem with them making a story out of it, but I wish I could just read the actual content and not the blathering of the author. (yes yes yes, I know, this is TheInq etc etc)
I have a QuadroFX 1600M chipset, which is basically an 8700M GT. So I'm pretty scared too.
I'm bitter and tear filled as well
Yes, I'm bitter about this Khan. I've been through 2 8800gt's already. And this 3rd one has a habit of flickering black every now and again...Coincidence? Maybe.
But I'm ditching this hunk of shite before it gets chance to fail asap.
Back to ATI I go.
Link to Huang's video response
The video of Huang's response on the chip issue is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZB6kxxgnOQMad as well
I have an 8700M GT with about a month left on the warranty. What happens to me when it fails in 6 months? Will nvidia repair my computer? Will they accept responsibility? They haven't yet and it hasn't failed yet, but if they are trying to cover it up (as it seems) then I get screwed out of a laptop if it breaks (as it appears it may). Then again maybe Jen-Hsun is telling the truth and the 8700M GT' in my laptop won't have that problem because my OEM didn't screw up the design. Keep up the good work inquirer and get to the bottom of this so I don't have to worry anymoreSuch childishness
The INQ seems to be sinking from amusingly sarcastic to inanely childish. By writing with such bias and immaturity, you're trying to make yourself more important than the story. Grow up and act like the wry semi-journalists you used to be.Half of all chips ever manufactured have below-average failure rates. Do you really think you live in a world where a company would be so irresponsible as to recall a hundred million products if far less than 1% fail? For some reason never stated, you clearly want Nvidia to go out of business tomorrow. Perhaps Khan got it right. But it sure is getting tiresome, and makes the INQ less and less worth reading.
Yeah
Yeah Nvidia pisses me off too but the pure unadulterated hatred for a company that might possibly just be trying to save their very existence, well it's just getting old. Believe me when I say we don't want Nvidia or ATI to sink. One without the other would totally suck. There would be no one to keep each other in check and call each other on their bullshit. Hypothetically speaking, if Nvidia went bankrupt who would there be left to compete with ATI to push technology forward? Intel and their paper GPU Larrabee? No we need both of them right where they are now, with ATI ahead a bit naturally :).It was funny for a while and seems alright when Charlie does it but not the whole writing staff, please.... enough.
So.
So is it true? Did nvidia released the story on the failures first?I'm glad when people don't just repeat a load of ads/PR on sites (like the inq does often enough), but pointlessly doing the opposite isn't a fix either, you should be a critical journalist not a sucking-up nor pissing-on child I think, to do that it help if you get some facts and report those, and check claims made by companies and report the results and add a little sidenote of factual data to expose the spin given when statements are made by PR guys.
Of course that's hard work and not always possible even, but still, one could try.
Nvidia is in the right here
An error in their chips? It happens. They compensate consumer in the full.Where is the problem?
This is right procedure. In manufacturing one tiny error and thousands of products are harmed. That the way it is.
Jen-Hsun is right. And I own both AMD and Nvidia cards. I've had several Ati cards for the price/performance recently, and my 7800GTX is still great after buying the next day after it came out (years ago).
Remember, this market is so competitive that analysts dislike it for the always shifting risk and alternating rise and fall of the respective two stocks. Thats a sure sign they go full out in favor of the consumer in order to one up each other. This will only continue if both companies are treated fairly. The minute one drops out entirely, you can be sure that the low price (both innovate or neither innovate Nash equilibrium, in this case both innovate) maintained on cards in this oligopoly will rise.
Remember, price and quality based competition is where you the consumer wants to be. (As far as investors are concerned, we hedge risk by aiding both companies. This is bad for us in lower profit margins, but once again good for the consumers, which happen to be about 60% of the computer using world (the rest being integrated chips from Intel)).
Stop badmouthing a great enterprise--you'll only ruin a good thing if you want people to firmly support one company only at all times. Right now Ati has done a great job with price/performance and had recovered some on the stock market. That is on its own competitive merit, and that is how it should be.
AMD will recover in the short-term and Nvidia will fall sharply in the short-term, but don't mistake the business cycle as what hints at some merit of a company. In this market, which is bound on changing manufacturing procedures yearly, this is common-place.
Look at analysts had been saying on Ati two weeks ago: "Stock will go to Zero! OMG! Sell!"
It didn't go to zero, but that badmouthing (which was on no premises other than AMD paid some large part of its debt) was a self-fullfilling prophecy, being that people who have no idea of the market get spooked. People who understand the market didn't listen to those pushers.
But those people who understood the market, the ones who saw that AMD cards outnumbered Nvida at local stores, who said lets buy Ati because they are better--these people got screwed after AMd fell for no reason due to media bashing it.
Now its recovering. Go figure. Smart invesotrs were right, but only those that weathered the selling frenzy were fine. The rest were right, but screwed by the media attacks. All that media crying and rubbish only hurts smart investors and consumers, instead pandering to the misunderstandings of the dumb majority.
Jen-Hsun did the right thing and came out about an error. Don't twist it to soem conspiracy. There is none yelling and jumping about standard events only hurts the market and indirectly the consumer.
What else could have been done?
I'm trying to figure out exactly what the inq would like done? Seems to me offering money for OEM's to fix the problem is better than anyone else has done in the past on any semi product. This story was over ages ago. I didn't see 100 AMD stories over the Barcy problems, what's the difference here? Story after story you guys just can't get off it. It's old, and they took a ONE TIME charge. Beating a dead horse isn't doing anything for your credibility, regardless of who's name you put at the top of the article. AFAIK they were the first to speak, and it came with a 200mil check attached. That's pretty good. Is he not correct in saying the customer doesn't have to fight as much by them offering money to the company that has to fix it? That' pretty much ends it, and leaves it with Nvidia trying to recover their money from the ACTUAL PRODUCER of the defective product. Which for customers, is an instant win.I'm actually thinking they should name the producer of the chips. Nvidia doesn't even make these things yet they're taking the blame. That's actually quite BIG of them to do this. Of course they did say they're going to SUE for the entire amount so I guess it's not too much of a loss anyway. What's a 200mil charge today if you're just going to sue next quarter to get it back. Only reputation is hurt, but I'm surprised they aren't talking about who made them. Must be a BIGGER check maybe written to NV in the works, or perhaps a future discount on tons of chips made or something. I can't see why they would take blame for something they didn't manufacture without a big $$ being in there for NV somewhere.
Anyway, quit now, before your credibility is shot to hell (not that it isn't already). No other rag, mag, or review site has written anything (even financial places) since the charge came out ages ago. The stock even went UP on the quarter...LOL. Give it up already. Even with $200mil charge (that they will sue for), they still make $650mil this year. Which looks a WHOLE lot better than AMD's 4bil loss for the year. At those rates it's like fining Microsoft. If I make 16Bil for the year, and you find me 1.5Bil what do I care? If I was Bill Gates I'd keep breaking the law too...ROFL. It's profitable for MS. This case is completely different than that, but the end result is the same. Even if NV has a 200mil failure every year (which hasn't been the case with ANY company) it's still worth it to make 650mil. Do the math. Their competitor on the other hand...
Honestly INQUIRER
Must you write with such a tone when making a news release on nvidia. The author come across as childish and spiteful for what ever reason, i will never know ?INQ editors, please grow up and have a little dignity.
Then why am I waiting?
Fixed right away my ass -"Current status
Hewlett-Packard is awaiting the arrival of a part to complete your product repair. Once the part is received, Hewlett-Packard will expedite the repair of your product and its return to you."
If I ever saw this guy in person I'd give him my fist to his face. What a moron.
Seems the only ones that thing this is a non-issue are those who's PCs are working.
COSTCO is currently doing an investigation, I received a call last night. Anybody who has problems and purchased from Costco let them know. I'm sure they would like to have some Nvidia money for all the time they are having to deal with support calls.